This paper addresses the wicked problem of measuring the productivity of learning and teaching in higher education. We show how fundamental validity issues and difficulties identified in educational productivity research point to the need for a qualitatively different framework when considering the entire question. We describe the work that needs to be done to reshape the way learning and teaching productivity is determined and show what a university needs to know and do about its approach to learning and teaching in order to understand quality and productivity. We also examine whether educational work is in fact 'wicked', as has been supposed. The concept of an Emergent Feedback Organization (EFO) is introduced along with the six things an organization needs to do to become an EFO capable of making a valid and reliable determination of productivity.